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HipMojo 9B: Content Creators vs Distribution Companies


welcome back to segment two of show 9 of

welcome back to segment two of show 9 of hip mojo so in the first segment we

hip mojo so in the first segment we

hip mojo so in the first segment we talked about media companies being at

talked about media companies being at

talked about media companies being at the mercy of tech and now we’re going to

the mercy of tech and now we’re going to

the mercy of tech and now we’re going to talk a little bit about the struggles

talk a little bit about the struggles

talk a little bit about the struggles so-called between content and the

so-called between content and the

so-called between content and the aggregators or the distribution

aggregators or the distribution

aggregators or the distribution companies well mojo is a Content company

companies well mojo is a Content company

companies well mojo is a Content company aren’t you guys pretty much at the mercy

aren’t you guys pretty much at the mercy

aren’t you guys pretty much at the mercy of tech just like any other media

of tech just like any other media

of tech just like any other media company um yeah I think if you take a

company um yeah I think if you take a

company um yeah I think if you take a look at the video battleground there’s

look at the video battleground there’s

look at the video battleground there’s actually four different quadrants you

actually four different quadrants you

actually four different quadrants you have the advertising so you know

have the advertising so you know

have the advertising so you know basically the ad networks or the

basically the ad networks or the

basically the ad networks or the technology that addresses advertising so

technology that addresses advertising so

technology that addresses advertising so it could be behavioral targeting and all

it could be behavioral targeting and all

it could be behavioral targeting and all that analytics you have technology so

that analytics you have technology so

that analytics you have technology so the online video platforms the content

the online video platforms the content

the online video platforms the content management systems the cdns you have the

management systems the cdns you have the

management systems the cdns you have the content creators and then you have the

content creators and then you have the

content creators and then you have the aggregators and the distribution

aggregators and the distribution

aggregators and the distribution companies and that could basically be a

companies and that could basically be a

companies and that could basically be a search engine that just indexes videos

search engine that just indexes videos

search engine that just indexes videos or it could be an aggregator that houses

or it could be an aggregator that houses

or it could be an aggregator that houses the videos so I think if you take a look

the videos so I think if you take a look

the videos so I think if you take a look at the content quadrant where watchmojo

at the content quadrant where watchmojo

at the content quadrant where watchmojo operates in we basically do sometimes

operates in we basically do sometimes

operates in we basically do sometimes overlap our frenemies so to call it are

overlap our frenemies so to call it are

overlap our frenemies so to call it are in the distribution sphere and then I

in the distribution sphere and then I

in the distribution sphere and then I think if you take a look at the

think if you take a look at the

think if you take a look at the advertising guys they overlap a lot with

advertising guys they overlap a lot with

advertising guys they overlap a lot with the technology guys well let’s talk to

the technology guys well let’s talk to

the technology guys well let’s talk to them that that frenemy thing because you

them that that frenemy thing because you

them that that frenemy thing because you hear it at least in the tech area a lot

hear it at least in the tech area a lot

hear it at least in the tech area a lot about co optician you know it’s it’s

about co optician you know it’s it’s

about co optician you know it’s it’s kind of like the semiotic competitive

kind of like the semiotic competitive

kind of like the semiotic competitive relationship you guys have deals with

relationship you guys have deals with

relationship you guys have deals with companies like five min 5 min grab yeah

companies like five min 5 min grab yeah

companies like five min 5 min grab yeah I mean okay here you are relying on your

I mean okay here you are relying on your

I mean okay here you are relying on your competition for all intents and purposes

competition for all intents and purposes

competition for all intents and purposes well okay this is an interesting thing

well okay this is an interesting thing

well okay this is an interesting thing that comes up in discussions we have so

that comes up in discussions we have so

that comes up in discussions we have so if five min when when five mins started

if five min when when five mins started

if five min when when five mins started five min actually marks the one-year

five min actually marks the one-year

five min actually marks the one-year anniversary of their exit to AOL for 65

anniversary of their exit to AOL for 65

anniversary of their exit to AOL for 65 million dollars five min is probably the

million dollars five min is probably the

million dollars five min is probably the only company since youtube that has had

only company since youtube that has had

only company since youtube that has had a good outcome exit wise most of the

a good outcome exit wise most of the

a good outcome exit wise most of the exits in video have been basically

exits in video have been basically

exits in video have been basically investors throwing in the towel saying

investors throwing in the towel saying

investors throwing in the towel saying we’re going to put a bullet in the head

we’re going to put a bullet in the head

we’re going to put a bullet in the head of the startup so five min deserves a

of the startup so five min deserves a

of the startup so five min deserves a lot of credit for what they’ve done when

lot of credit for what they’ve done when

lot of credit for what they’ve done when 51 started it was a site that aggregated

51 started it was a site that aggregated

51 started it was a site that aggregated user-generated content or

user-generated content or

user-generated content or how to videos their competitors so to

how to videos their competitors so to

how to videos their competitors so to speak mainly was a company like Howcast

speak mainly was a company like Howcast

speak mainly was a company like Howcast howcast was also a website that produced

howcast was also a website that produced

howcast was also a website that produced video so it was professional content

video so it was professional content

video so it was professional content around user-generated content so on day

around user-generated content so on day

around user-generated content so on day one they’re more close competitors we

one they’re more close competitors we

one they’re more close competitors we have nothing really to do with I’m sure

have nothing really to do with I’m sure

have nothing really to do with I’m sure we produce videos like Howcast and we

we produce videos like Howcast and we

we produce videos like Howcast and we have some how-to videos but we’re

have some how-to videos but we’re

have some how-to videos but we’re covering everything from profile

covering everything from profile

covering everything from profile celebrity you know bios of people and

celebrity you know bios of people and

celebrity you know bios of people and whatnot now today howcast remains a

whatnot now today howcast remains a

whatnot now today howcast remains a producer of how-to videos and that’s all

producer of how-to videos and that’s all

producer of how-to videos and that’s all that they do and five men took off by

that they do and five men took off by

that they do and five men took off by partnering with professional content

partnering with professional content

partnering with professional content producers sort of overlooking the how-to

producers sort of overlooking the how-to

producers sort of overlooking the how-to things it’s almost like they they use

things it’s almost like they they use

things it’s almost like they they use the the UGC as a jumping point as a

the the UGC as a jumping point as a

the the UGC as a jumping point as a building point a distribution network

building point a distribution network

building point a distribution network and then they go after guys like you

and then they go after guys like you

and then they go after guys like you what well no but they want is they want

what well no but they want is they want

what well no but they want is they want our content because that’s what

our content because that’s what

our content because that’s what advertisers want now the argument that

advertisers want now the argument that

advertisers want now the argument that well why do you give content to five min

well why do you give content to five min

well why do you give content to five min it will then why stop at five min why

it will then why stop at five min why

it will then why stop at five min why would we house our videos on YouTube why

would we house our videos on YouTube why

would we house our videos on YouTube why would we how’s it on yahoo video why

would we how’s it on yahoo video why

would we how’s it on yahoo video why would we how’s it on hulu right now in

would we how’s it on hulu right now in

would we how’s it on hulu right now in terms of war video is the content

terms of war video is the content

terms of war video is the content creators and the distribution companies

creators and the distribution companies

creators and the distribution companies are two sides of a coin the difference

are two sides of a coin the difference

are two sides of a coin the difference is in content you don’t have to be

is in content you don’t have to be

is in content you don’t have to be number one to win you could be coke to

number one to win you could be coke to

number one to win you could be coke to somebody else’s Pepsi and vice versa

somebody else’s Pepsi and vice versa

somebody else’s Pepsi and vice versa heck you could be jolt and everybody

heck you could be jolt and everybody

heck you could be jolt and everybody sort of can get a piece of the pie when

sort of can get a piece of the pie when

sort of can get a piece of the pie when it comes to the distribution it’s a

it comes to the distribution it’s a

it comes to the distribution it’s a winner-takes-all it’s a zero-sum game

winner-takes-all it’s a zero-sum game

winner-takes-all it’s a zero-sum game youtube became number one because it

youtube became number one because it

youtube became number one because it basically slaughtered rehberg uba crush

basically slaughtered rehberg uba crush

basically slaughtered rehberg uba crush dailymotion and metacafe and you know

dailymotion and metacafe and you know

dailymotion and metacafe and you know made the juice look like Titanic you

made the juice look like Titanic you

made the juice look like Titanic you know I wouldn’t even call it

know I wouldn’t even call it

know I wouldn’t even call it slaughtering them they all came after

slaughtering them they all came after

slaughtering them they all came after you tube after you tube is already up

you tube after you tube is already up

you tube after you tube is already up and successful they kind of everyone

and successful they kind of everyone

and successful they kind of everyone before Google was up before YouTube’s

before Google was up before YouTube’s

before Google was up before YouTube’s was only registered as a URL in 2005 and

was only registered as a URL in 2005 and

was only registered as a URL in 2005 and it exited 18 months later because it

it exited 18 months later because it

it exited 18 months later because it realized it needed a big parent like

realized it needed a big parent like

realized it needed a big parent like Google to fund its growth but but

Google to fund its growth but but

Google to fund its growth but but YouTube was actually somewhat profitable

YouTube was actually somewhat profitable

YouTube was actually somewhat profitable at the time it sold but my point is that

at the time it sold but my point is that

at the time it sold but my point is that now we are the good thing about a

now we are the good thing about a

now we are the good thing about a Content company is we could then over

Content company is we could then over

Content company is we could then over time flip a switch and say well we’re

time flip a switch and say well we’re

time flip a switch and say well we’re not going to be feeding content like an

not going to be feeding content like an

not going to be feeding content like an arms dealer to youtube or five min or

arms dealer to youtube or five min or

arms dealer to youtube or five min or Hulu and then we could align ourselves

Hulu and then we could align ourselves

Hulu and then we could align ourselves with one company and pull our content

with one company and pull our content

with one company and pull our content and do what we want if you are let’s say

and do what we want if you are let’s say

and do what we want if you are let’s say a media company just going to use

a media company just going to use

a media company just going to use company XYZ I don’t want to name any of

company XYZ I don’t want to name any of

company XYZ I don’t want to name any of our partners if your company XYZ you

our partners if your company XYZ you

our partners if your company XYZ you come to watch module this is the

come to watch module this is the

come to watch module this is the critique I sometimes get

critique I sometimes get

critique I sometimes get yes they might be interested in our

yes they might be interested in our

yes they might be interested in our content and true they might be able to

content and true they might be able to

content and true they might be able to get our content from five min but if

get our content from five min but if

get our content from five min but if company XYZ takes five min player and

company XYZ takes five min player and

company XYZ takes five min player and technology and our content is in there

technology and our content is in there

technology and our content is in there that company XYZ is not really in

that company XYZ is not really in

that company XYZ is not really in control they have to work through five

control they have to work through five

control they have to work through five mins player whereas if they work with a

mins player whereas if they work with a

mins player whereas if they work with a watchmojo well they’re free to use

watchmojo well they’re free to use

watchmojo well they’re free to use whatever player that they want and have

whatever player that they want and have

whatever player that they want and have control of the advertising and the tech

control of the advertising and the tech

control of the advertising and the tech right so at the end of the day anybody

right so at the end of the day anybody

right so at the end of the day anybody could be a competitor with everyone it’s

could be a competitor with everyone it’s

could be a competitor with everyone it’s still very early there’s competitors

still very early there’s competitors

still very early there’s competitors that become you know friends overnight

that become you know friends overnight

that become you know friends overnight and vice versa but what I what I try to

and vice versa but what I what I try to

and vice versa but what I what I try to get you is that it’s a very very long

get you is that it’s a very very long

get you is that it’s a very very long marathon so I wouldn’t be too worried

marathon so I wouldn’t be too worried

marathon so I wouldn’t be too worried about why we partner with a given

about why we partner with a given

about why we partner with a given company and why we don’t it’s really

company and why we don’t it’s really

company and why we don’t it’s really just about sort of building more

just about sort of building more

just about sort of building more traction building the brand building the

traction building the brand building the

traction building the brand building the catalogue and then over time that the

catalogue and then over time that the

catalogue and then over time that the roles won’t change companies that work

roles won’t change companies that work

roles won’t change companies that work together now will be enemies just on the

together now will be enemies just on the

together now will be enemies just on the record labels were basically on the

record labels were basically on the

record labels were basically on the verge of suing YouTube into like

verge of suing YouTube into like

verge of suing YouTube into like oblivion and then what happened somebody

oblivion and then what happened somebody

oblivion and then what happened somebody had YouTube at the foresight to say well

had YouTube at the foresight to say well

had YouTube at the foresight to say well wait a second instead of you guys suing

wait a second instead of you guys suing

wait a second instead of you guys suing us why don’t we basically build vivo and

us why don’t we basically build vivo and

us why don’t we basically build vivo and some genius basically told the lawyers

some genius basically told the lawyers

some genius basically told the lawyers to go back underneath the rock and

to go back underneath the rock and

to go back underneath the rock and brought out the biz dev guys and they

brought out the biz dev guys and they

brought out the biz dev guys and they signed a great partnership right so

signed a great partnership right so

signed a great partnership right so these things change over time so it’d

these things change over time so it’d

these things change over time so it’d almost be like a newspaper looking at

almost be like a newspaper looking at

almost be like a newspaper looking at the newsstand as an antagonistic

the newsstand as an antagonistic

the newsstand as an antagonistic relationship just because the newsstand

relationship just because the newsstand

relationship just because the newsstand carries its competitors public exactly

carries its competitors public exactly

carries its competitors public exactly yep and at the end of the day I don’t

yep and at the end of the day I don’t

yep and at the end of the day I don’t think it makes sense for newspapers to

think it makes sense for newspapers to

think it makes sense for newspapers to do everything for us we have a team that

do everything for us we have a team that

do everything for us we have a team that is creating some of the best content out

is creating some of the best content out

is creating some of the best content out there it doesn’t make sense for us then

there it doesn’t make sense for us then

there it doesn’t make sense for us then to split that resource and say well

to split that resource and say well

to split that resource and say well we’re also going to build a player

we’re also going to build a player

we’re also going to build a player technology and we’re gonna worry about

technology and we’re gonna worry about

technology and we’re gonna worry about the agree with you wholeheartedly you

the agree with you wholeheartedly you

the agree with you wholeheartedly you know even it to a certain degree by

know even it to a certain degree by

know even it to a certain degree by partnering with companies like five min

partnering with companies like five min

partnering with companies like five min you you get to outsource a lot of your

you you get to outsource a lot of your

you you get to outsource a lot of your ad sales and you get to focus on on your

ad sales and you get to focus on on your

ad sales and you get to focus on on your core business model ok now let me ask

core business model ok now let me ask

core business model ok now let me ask you something is there any merit anymore

you something is there any merit anymore

you something is there any merit anymore like where did you ever watch arrested

like where did you ever watch arrested

like where did you ever watch arrested development a little bit naughty i

development a little bit naughty i

development a little bit naughty i actually did was one of the few shows i

actually did was one of the few shows i

actually did was one of the few shows i watch was pretty entertaining would you

watch was pretty entertaining would you

watch was pretty entertaining would you if arrested development has always had

if arrested development has always had

if arrested development has always had this sort of like cultish following and

this sort of like cultish following and

this sort of like cultish following and and there’s rumors that they’re going to

and there’s rumors that they’re going to

and there’s rumors that they’re going to come back there’s also some truth to the

come back there’s also some truth to the

come back there’s also some truth to the fact that Fox might not be interested in

fact that Fox might not be interested in

fact that Fox might not be interested in bidding for it so Netflix apparently is

bidding for it so Netflix apparently is

bidding for it so Netflix apparently is coming up and saying we’re interested in

coming up and saying we’re interested in

coming up and saying we’re interested in bidding it and then you see someone like

bidding it and then you see someone like

bidding it and then you see someone like Glenn Beck leaving fox and now he has

Glenn Beck leaving fox and now he has

Glenn Beck leaving fox and now he has his own online presence and he’s doing a

his own online presence and he’s doing a

his own online presence and he’s doing a lot of these things which goes straight

lot of these things which goes straight

lot of these things which goes straight to web and TVs almost an afterthought

to web and TVs almost an afterthought

to web and TVs almost an afterthought does offline distribution ever matter to

does offline distribution ever matter to

does offline distribution ever matter to you I think well it still it still has a

you I think well it still it still has a

you I think well it still it still has a lot of potential like if you can get

lot of potential like if you can get

lot of potential like if you can get offline distribution there still gives

offline distribution there still gives

offline distribution there still gives you a lot of perceived credibility and

you a lot of perceived credibility and

you a lot of perceived credibility and you know you’ll you’ll get some

you know you’ll you’ll get some

you know you’ll you’ll get some interesting instant cash injection I

interesting instant cash injection I

interesting instant cash injection I don’t think you need it anymore and I

don’t think you need it anymore and I

don’t think you need it anymore and I think it won’t even be a thought in

think it won’t even be a thought in

think it won’t even be a thought in probably five to ten years in the way we

probably five to ten years in the way we

probably five to ten years in the way we are now because the fact of the matter

are now because the fact of the matter

are now because the fact of the matter is is I can go out and push up my

is is I can go out and push up my

is is I can go out and push up my contents across a lot of not ugc

contents across a lot of not ugc

contents across a lot of not ugc channels but self-serve platforms ugc

channels but self-serve platforms ugc

channels but self-serve platforms ugc channels yeah well you know I i can

channels yeah well you know I i can

channels yeah well you know I i can write a great novel i can upload it to

write a great novel i can upload it to

write a great novel i can upload it to kindle i can sell it and i don’t even

kindle i can sell it and i don’t even

kindle i can sell it and i don’t even need the publishing houses anymore so

need the publishing houses anymore so

need the publishing houses anymore so it’s nice to have it I don’t think

it’s nice to have it I don’t think

it’s nice to have it I don’t think something like Arrested Development even

something like Arrested Development even

something like Arrested Development even needs it especially they got so much

needs it especially they got so much

needs it especially they got so much brand recognition if they went straight

brand recognition if they went straight

brand recognition if they went straight to Netflix the cult following will

to Netflix the cult following will

to Netflix the cult following will follow and any of them who are not using

follow and any of them who are not using

follow and any of them who are not using netflix will start just because of that

netflix will start just because of that

netflix will start just because of that and I think that’s why Netflix is

and I think that’s why Netflix is

and I think that’s why Netflix is interested well I think that’s the thing

interested well I think that’s the thing

interested well I think that’s the thing that you mentioned is the branding I

that you mentioned is the branding I

that you mentioned is the branding I think if you have a strong brand you

think if you have a strong brand you

think if you have a strong brand you probably don’t need to rely on the

probably don’t need to rely on the

probably don’t need to rely on the offline but I think if you don’t have a

offline but I think if you don’t have a

offline but I think if you don’t have a brand and you want to build some kind of

brand and you want to build some kind of

brand and you want to build some kind of presence and distribution online only

presence and distribution online only

presence and distribution online only it’s not gonna work as the netflixs are

it’s not gonna work as the netflixs are

it’s not gonna work as the netflixs are not going to care about you so that’s

not going to care about you so that’s

not going to care about you so that’s the thing and a few years ago I thought

the thing and a few years ago I thought

the thing and a few years ago I thought that the celebrities who are doing these

that the celebrities who are doing these

that the celebrities who are doing these things online we’re doing it because it

things online we’re doing it because it

things online we’re doing it because it was sexy and invoke I think it’s

was sexy and invoke I think it’s

was sexy and invoke I think it’s interesting to see who’s going to keep

interesting to see who’s going to keep

interesting to see who’s going to keep doing it and who’s going to go back to

doing it and who’s going to go back to

doing it and who’s going to go back to TV which is where the sexy and the big

TV which is where the sexy and the big

TV which is where the sexy and the big idea I think it’ll come down to who can

idea I think it’ll come down to who can

idea I think it’ll come down to who can actually market themselves effectively

actually market themselves effectively

actually market themselves effectively because pretty much whether you’re

because pretty much whether you’re

because pretty much whether you’re talking about a network or a publisher

talking about a network or a publisher

talking about a network or a publisher they offer three main things they offer

they offer three main things they offer

they offer three main things they offer the publishing of the content the

the publishing of the content the

the publishing of the content the distribution of the content and the

distribution of the content and the

distribution of the content and the marketing of the content the way the

marketing of the content the way the

marketing of the content the way the technology has evolved you definitely

technology has evolved you definitely

technology has evolved you definitely don’t need people to publish and to

don’t need people to publish and to

don’t need people to publish and to distribute anymore which you really need

distribute anymore which you really need

distribute anymore which you really need help with is the marketing so someone

help with is the marketing so someone

help with is the marketing so someone like Glenn Beck he has name recognition

like Glenn Beck he has name recognition

like Glenn Beck he has name recognition he doesn’t need that anymore he can go

he doesn’t need that anymore he can go

he doesn’t need that anymore he can go off and if he’s smart about it can push

off and if he’s smart about it can push

off and if he’s smart about it can push his own thing obviously if i’m a more of

his own thing obviously if i’m a more of

his own thing obviously if i’m a more of an indie filmmaker i’m probably not

an indie filmmaker i’m probably not

an indie filmmaker i’m probably not gonna I’m not guaranteed any viral

gonna I’m not guaranteed any viral

gonna I’m not guaranteed any viral success by shooting a small web series

success by shooting a small web series

success by shooting a small web series the only thing i find interesting then

the only thing i find interesting then

the only thing i find interesting then we’ll move to lightning round is back in

we’ll move to lightning round is back in

we’ll move to lightning round is back in the day when you basically published a

the day when you basically published a

the day when you basically published a book and you charge ten dollars for that

book and you charge ten dollars for that

book and you charge ten dollars for that book that was a reflection of the cost

book that was a reflection of the cost

book that was a reflection of the cost of manufacturing and producing that

of manufacturing and producing that

of manufacturing and producing that physical riesling that’s it today the

physical riesling that’s it today the

physical riesling that’s it today the marginal cost of production is almost

marginal cost of production is almost

marginal cost of production is almost zero I think that’s why you get like

zero I think that’s why you get like

zero I think that’s why you get like Seth Godin who’s like just take my book

Seth Godin who’s like just take my book

Seth Godin who’s like just take my book for free because it’s a marketing tool

for free because it’s a marketing tool

for free because it’s a marketing tool so I think a lot of creative types have

so I think a lot of creative types have

so I think a lot of creative types have no

no

no figure that out that no I yeah they’re

figure that out that no I yeah they’re

figure that out that no I yeah they’re all haven’t even even if you look at the

all haven’t even even if you look at the

all haven’t even even if you look at the price point it came down to like if I it

price point it came down to like if I it

price point it came down to like if I it was going to cost me whether my book was

was going to cost me whether my book was

was going to cost me whether my book was 50 pages or 500 pages there was still a

50 pages or 500 pages there was still a

50 pages or 500 pages there was still a certain minimum cost to like print it

certain minimum cost to like print it

certain minimum cost to like print it bind it and ship it which means that it

bind it and ship it which means that it

bind it and ship it which means that it was I couldn’t charge less than a

was I couldn’t charge less than a

was I couldn’t charge less than a certain amount on the Shelf now be give

certain amount on the Shelf now be give

certain amount on the Shelf now be give whatever that price was no one was going

whatever that price was no one was going

whatever that price was no one was going to pay that much for a 50 page book so

to pay that much for a 50 page book so

to pay that much for a 50 page book so books tended to be 300 pages and up and

books tended to be 300 pages and up and

books tended to be 300 pages and up and now as ebooks Lakes start proliferating

now as ebooks Lakes start proliferating

now as ebooks Lakes start proliferating you notice lots of micro content you

you notice lots of micro content you

you notice lots of micro content you know 4050 page books they’re selling for

know 4050 page books they’re selling for

know 4050 page books they’re selling for 99 cents because you know there’s those

99 cents because you know there’s those

99 cents because you know there’s those costs have been completely eroded cool

costs have been completely eroded cool

costs have been completely eroded cool we’ll take a break and we’ll be back for

we’ll take a break and we’ll be back for

we’ll take a break and we’ll be back for lightning well

”

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