Can poetry and music make leaders change behavior? | Julia Romanowska | TEDxStockholm

how well gives you an opportunity to act

how well gives you an opportunity to act destructively because of this we need to

destructively because of this we need to

destructively because of this we need to address a serious question how can we

address a serious question how can we

address a serious question how can we get leaders to understand the degree of

get leaders to understand the degree of

get leaders to understand the degree of moral responsibility and courage that

moral responsibility and courage that

moral responsibility and courage that comes with power as a leadership trainer

comes with power as a leadership trainer

comes with power as a leadership trainer working with conventional program I

working with conventional program I

working with conventional program I wanted to know if there is a better way

wanted to know if there is a better way

wanted to know if there is a better way to help leaders become more responsible

to help leaders become more responsible

to help leaders become more responsible so one day a group of 50 managers and

so one day a group of 50 managers and

so one day a group of 50 managers and about 200 subordinate arrived to provide

about 200 subordinate arrived to provide

about 200 subordinate arrived to provide blood samples then some weeks later 25

blood samples then some weeks later 25

blood samples then some weeks later 25 of the managers are told where to go and

of the managers are told where to go and

of the managers are told where to go and when without any other explanation they

when without any other explanation they

when without any other explanation they are also told that they might feel

are also told that they might feel

are also told that they might feel uncomfortable once they arrived they are

uncomfortable once they arrived they are

uncomfortable once they arrived they are led into a black painted room with no

led into a black painted room with no

led into a black painted room with no windows

windows

windows again notice intentions no explanations

again notice intentions no explanations

again notice intentions no explanations simply a man and the woman alone on an

simply a man and the woman alone on an

simply a man and the woman alone on an empty stage with music fragments of

empty stage with music fragments of

empty stage with music fragments of poetry like this already he shouts after

poetry like this already he shouts after

poetry like this already he shouts after her one is she my daughter my undefiled

her one is she my daughter my undefiled

her one is she my daughter my undefiled your tongue honey and milk the fragrance

your tongue honey and milk the fragrance

your tongue honey and milk the fragrance of your garments is like the smell of

of your garments is like the smell of

of your garments is like the smell of Lebanon she’s not coming this woman she

Lebanon she’s not coming this woman she

Lebanon she’s not coming this woman she never feels really on earth

never feels really on earth

never feels really on earth the Sun for so many years has been the

the Sun for so many years has been the

the Sun for so many years has been the unloved here he is now in his bed faded

unloved here he is now in his bed faded

unloved here he is now in his bed faded the child and though her whole world the

the child and though her whole world the

the child and though her whole world the tiger like this tenderly kisses the

tiger like this tenderly kisses the

tiger like this tenderly kisses the mother her little boat that sails around

mother her little boat that sails around

mother her little boat that sails around the world then she takes the plastic bag

the world then she takes the plastic bag

the world then she takes the plastic bag modern and death fine quiet waves for

modern and death fine quiet waves for

modern and death fine quiet waves for love is as strong as a death so goes the

love is as strong as a death so goes the

love is as strong as a death so goes the world straight in to us the black room

world straight in to us the black room

world straight in to us the black room are the blood samples the poetry and the

are the blood samples the poetry and the

are the blood samples the poetry and the music all parts of a leadership training

music all parts of a leadership training

music all parts of a leadership training study as an artist and musician I know

study as an artist and musician I know

study as an artist and musician I know the power of the Arts and the idea for

the power of the Arts and the idea for

the power of the Arts and the idea for this unusual experiment comes from an

this unusual experiment comes from an

this unusual experiment comes from an art form and that I invented a collage

art form and that I invented a collage

art form and that I invented a collage of rapidly changing words in music that

of rapidly changing words in music that

of rapidly changing words in music that I called a bullet award meaning crossing

I called a bullet award meaning crossing

I called a bullet award meaning crossing boundaries I noticed that the tensions

boundaries I noticed that the tensions

boundaries I noticed that the tensions and the contradictions of the text music

and the contradictions of the text music

and the contradictions of the text music provoked strong emotions and the feeling

provoked strong emotions and the feeling

provoked strong emotions and the feeling of instability in the audience like the

of instability in the audience like the

of instability in the audience like the experiences in rituals that

experiences in rituals that

experiences in rituals that anthropologists call living a liminal

anthropologists call living a liminal

anthropologists call living a liminal experiences might be fearless crises you

experiences might be fearless crises you

experiences might be fearless crises you are in this completely alone and do not

are in this completely alone and do not

are in this completely alone and do not know what will happen to you this

know what will happen to you this

know what will happen to you this elusive transition of being in between

elusive transition of being in between

elusive transition of being in between on the way to cross a boundary makes

on the way to cross a boundary makes

on the way to cross a boundary makes something happen you change and you

something happen you change and you

something happen you change and you discover that you might believe someone

discover that you might believe someone

discover that you might believe someone you never imagined possible

the abrupt shifts became not in one’s

the abrupt shifts became not in one’s soul you couldn’t defend yourself from

soul you couldn’t defend yourself from

soul you couldn’t defend yourself from the text and music

the text and music

the text and music it took your breath away you were shaken

it took your breath away you were shaken

it took your breath away you were shaken shocked dumbfounded I was taking by the

shocked dumbfounded I was taking by the

shocked dumbfounded I was taking by the losses awesomeness couldn’t get away

losses awesomeness couldn’t get away

losses awesomeness couldn’t get away felt sick the most difficult issues here

felt sick the most difficult issues here

felt sick the most difficult issues here we were in it allowing herself to be

we were in it allowing herself to be

we were in it allowing herself to be upset violated and out of that has grown

upset violated and out of that has grown

upset violated and out of that has grown something new I wonder it can defect

something new I wonder it can defect

something new I wonder it can defect revoked by the Shibboleth format improve

revoked by the Shibboleth format improve

revoked by the Shibboleth format improve leadership training can the power of

leadership training can the power of

leadership training can the power of poetry and music make leaders change

poetry and music make leaders change

poetry and music make leaders change behavior and above all how do I know if

behavior and above all how do I know if

behavior and above all how do I know if it’s really works so research fans gave

it’s really works so research fans gave

it’s really works so research fans gave me an opportunity to create and test

me an opportunity to create and test

me an opportunity to create and test this concept at the Karolinska Institute

this concept at the Karolinska Institute

this concept at the Karolinska Institute in Stockholm that’s how we came to have

in Stockholm that’s how we came to have

in Stockholm that’s how we came to have a group of 25 managers listening to the

a group of 25 managers listening to the

a group of 25 managers listening to the readings and music that writing talking

readings and music that writing talking

readings and music that writing talking about anything delight for nearly one

about anything delight for nearly one

about anything delight for nearly one year mean why the other 25 managers

year mean why the other 25 managers

year mean why the other 25 managers attended a more conventional leadership

attended a more conventional leadership

attended a more conventional leadership training led by the Swedish Defence

training led by the Swedish Defence

training led by the Swedish Defence Force our managers were randomly

Force our managers were randomly

Force our managers were randomly selected into the two groups and were

selected into the two groups and were

selected into the two groups and were not told what the different programs

not told what the different programs

not told what the different programs involved this way we could compare the

involved this way we could compare the

involved this way we could compare the Shibboleth art program and the

Shibboleth art program and the

Shibboleth art program and the conventional one in a strictly

conventional one in a strictly

conventional one in a strictly scientific way it managed a completed

scientific way it managed a completed

scientific way it managed a completed psychological test and self-assessment

psychological test and self-assessment

psychological test and self-assessment and subordinates were asked to evaluate

and subordinates were asked to evaluate

and subordinates were asked to evaluate in the managers behavior black samples

in the managers behavior black samples

in the managers behavior black samples were collected to test for hormones

were collected to test for hormones

were collected to test for hormones related to stress and we didn’t stop

related to stress and we didn’t stop

related to stress and we didn’t stop there a change in the managers behavior

there a change in the managers behavior

there a change in the managers behavior after the program should make a

after the program should make a

after the program should make a difference in the workplace so we

difference in the workplace so we

difference in the workplace so we collected the subordinates blood samples

collected the subordinates blood samples

collected the subordinates blood samples – and followed

– and followed

– and followed their mental has with questionnaires all

their mental has with questionnaires all

their mental has with questionnaires all evaluations were made three times before

evaluations were made three times before

evaluations were made three times before the start two months after the end and

the start two months after the end and

the start two months after the end and six months later what did we find we

six months later what did we find we

six months later what did we find we found striking differences between the

found striking differences between the

found striking differences between the two groups the statistically significant

two groups the statistically significant

two groups the statistically significant results indicate long-lasting effect in

results indicate long-lasting effect in

results indicate long-lasting effect in pro-social motivation we saw that it

pro-social motivation we saw that it

pro-social motivation we saw that it increased in the Shibboleth leaders the

increased in the Shibboleth leaders the

increased in the Shibboleth leaders the red bar and did not change in the

red bar and did not change in the

red bar and did not change in the control group leaders the blue bar

control group leaders the blue bar

control group leaders the blue bar psychological resilience increased at

psychological resilience increased at

psychological resilience increased at eight months after the end in the

eight months after the end in the

eight months after the end in the Shibboleth leaders the red bar and it

Shibboleth leaders the red bar and it

Shibboleth leaders the red bar and it decreased in turn control group leaders

decreased in turn control group leaders

decreased in turn control group leaders the blue bar here is the leaders

the blue bar here is the leaders

the blue bar here is the leaders behavior evaluated by the subordinate

behavior evaluated by the subordinate

behavior evaluated by the subordinate first we have responsibility the courage

first we have responsibility the courage

first we have responsibility the courage to act and make necessary decision and

to act and make necessary decision and

to act and make necessary decision and then stress sculpting the ability to

then stress sculpting the ability to

then stress sculpting the ability to harm the complexity ambivalence and

harm the complexity ambivalence and

harm the complexity ambivalence and insecurity both responsibility and

insecurity both responsibility and

insecurity both responsibility and stress coping increased in the

stress coping increased in the

stress coping increased in the Shibboleth leaders and it decreased in

Shibboleth leaders and it decreased in

Shibboleth leaders and it decreased in the control group leaders a

the control group leaders a

the control group leaders a significantly higher blood concentration

significantly higher blood concentration

significantly higher blood concentration of the regenerative hormone DHT is the

of the regenerative hormone DHT is the

of the regenerative hormone DHT is the redline was found in both managers and

redline was found in both managers and

redline was found in both managers and subordinates in the Shibboleth group

subordinates in the Shibboleth group

subordinates in the Shibboleth group compared to the control group the blue

compared to the control group the blue

compared to the control group the blue line confirming the hormone findings but

line confirming the hormone findings but

line confirming the hormone findings but managers and subordinates in the

managers and subordinates in the

managers and subordinates in the Shibboleth group reported improved

Shibboleth group reported improved

Shibboleth group reported improved mental health they were in a better

mental health they were in a better

mental health they were in a better frame of mind they had more energy while

frame of mind they had more energy while

frame of mind they had more energy while sleeping better

sleeping better

sleeping better they self-esteem had improved and also

they self-esteem had improved and also

they self-esteem had improved and also ability to deal with conflicts in the

ability to deal with conflicts in the

ability to deal with conflicts in the control group men

control group men

control group men subordinates reported decreased mental

subordinates reported decreased mental

subordinates reported decreased mental health and also decreased ability to

health and also decreased ability to

health and also decreased ability to deal with conflicts finally decrease

deal with conflicts finally decrease

deal with conflicts finally decrease discrepancy between managers

discrepancy between managers

discrepancy between managers self-scoring and subordinates scoring of

self-scoring and subordinates scoring of

self-scoring and subordinates scoring of managers indicates greater

managers indicates greater

managers indicates greater self-awareness and humility in the

self-awareness and humility in the

self-awareness and humility in the Shibboleth leaders in the control group

Shibboleth leaders in the control group

Shibboleth leaders in the control group contrary to the more objective result

contrary to the more objective result

contrary to the more objective result the managers self-ratings show improved

the managers self-ratings show improved

the managers self-ratings show improved leadership

leadership

leadership this indicates a dangerous pendency to

this indicates a dangerous pendency to

this indicates a dangerous pendency to self-deception encounters to the

self-deception encounters to the

self-deception encounters to the conventional program see bullet

conventional program see bullet

conventional program see bullet provoking deep critical self-examination

provoking deep critical self-examination

provoking deep critical self-examination breaking selves illusions

breaking selves illusions

breaking selves illusions through a challenging art form and

through a challenging art form and

through a challenging art form and demanding harrowing content forcing

demanding harrowing content forcing

demanding harrowing content forcing leaders to see the world through the

leaders to see the world through the

leaders to see the world through the eyes of others the Shibboleth place were

eyes of others the Shibboleth place were

eyes of others the Shibboleth place were quite unpleasant I couldn’t be

quite unpleasant I couldn’t be

quite unpleasant I couldn’t be indifferent you forced to deal what what

indifferent you forced to deal what what

indifferent you forced to deal what what is presented

is presented

is presented I was forced to really sit down and

I was forced to really sit down and

I was forced to really sit down and think through what does what I just

think through what does what I just

think through what does what I just heard me so I started looking at myself

heard me so I started looking at myself

heard me so I started looking at myself what is good and evil

what is good and evil

what is good and evil when do I choose it like these

when do I choose it like these

when do I choose it like these concentration camps does one make the

concentration camps does one make the

concentration camps does one make the choice later or now I’ve never been

choice later or now I’ve never been

choice later or now I’ve never been through this before this has got closer

through this before this has got closer

through this before this has got closer to me in a way I haven’t experienced

to me in a way I haven’t experienced

to me in a way I haven’t experienced before when they were trapped on the

before when they were trapped on the

before when they were trapped on the train it touched me incredibly my airway

train it touched me incredibly my airway

train it touched me incredibly my airway suddenly felt very constricted and I

suddenly felt very constricted and I

suddenly felt very constricted and I could almost see the gas in front of me

could almost see the gas in front of me

could almost see the gas in front of me what the hell is it that means anything

what the hell is it that means anything

what the hell is it that means anything in this world more than life

the effect of Shibboleth was not only

the effect of Shibboleth was not only transformative on the managers but also

transformative on the managers but also

transformative on the managers but also transferred to other people improving

transferred to other people improving

transferred to other people improving they psychological and biological

they psychological and biological

they psychological and biological resilience the key learning from this

resilience the key learning from this

resilience the key learning from this research is that strong art experiences

research is that strong art experiences

research is that strong art experiences connecting us closer to actual reality

connecting us closer to actual reality

connecting us closer to actual reality make the world felt and expand of human

make the world felt and expand of human

make the world felt and expand of human suffering ceases to be an abstraction

suffering ceases to be an abstraction

suffering ceases to be an abstraction leader responsibility can not be based

leader responsibility can not be based

leader responsibility can not be based on ideas but on close honest to add a

on ideas but on close honest to add a

on ideas but on close honest to add a human being so now I have a new question

human being so now I have a new question

human being so now I have a new question to work on could this approach leads to

to work on could this approach leads to

to work on could this approach leads to long lasting solutions to social

long lasting solutions to social

long lasting solutions to social problems could the power of poetry and

problems could the power of poetry and

problems could the power of poetry and music linking our senses to the world

music linking our senses to the world

music linking our senses to the world prevent for instance extremism by

prevent for instance extremism by

prevent for instance extremism by inducing deep respect for life and human

inducing deep respect for life and human

inducing deep respect for life and human dignity as contrary values

yes we carry everything within us garden

yes we carry everything within us garden heaven and hell and earth and life and

heaven and hell and earth and life and

heaven and hell and earth and life and death and all of history either you live

death and all of history either you live

death and all of history either you live in laughter we’re tears it is still only

in laughter we’re tears it is still only

in laughter we’re tears it is still only one life life in its thousands of

one life life in its thousands of

one life life in its thousands of details and nuances and movements large

details and nuances and movements large

details and nuances and movements large [Music]

[Music]

[Music] [Applause]