if I’m to hurt and by my
colleagues
in any case I am there when
the organizing team first me
invited to come and talk to you
today I had a reaction a little
mixed on one side I was
enthusiastic because how to refuse
such a forum to have an audience
also knowledgeable and at the same time easy
going but also manage a little bit of
I was a little skeptical because
what is a teacher researcher
modest like me can do well in
a ted conference
and then what to say she is more austere
from my colleagues I practice a
discipline called science
policy
it’s a discipline where the
scientifically regularly handed
challenged by the most austere
of our colleagues precisely because
many other colleagues
regularly intervene in
media and often it takes the
recognize to say nothing but I
practical or in any case I believe in this
that some call sociology
public where public policy science
if you want public sociology
it is not accumulating
knowledge knowledge for the
knowledge
I missed my introduction but it’s
no matter how bad are you going to tell you
just now that I did not have big
things to do
in talent because I did not have
cross the oceans to others
sharks I did not have either
april2010 alleges that the
African continent
and then I’m the author of only one
original invention that deserved the award
nobel
so I resume public sociology
is it to his public survival
it’s producing knowledge but
it is especially to circulate them
bring out
of the academic world of borders
from the university there are several
ways to do it there are
teaching of course there are also some
lectures like like today
the interest of this public authority
it’s about showing and spreading
acquired social meanings what is these
social issues these are sciences
that allow to believe to increase
pardon the critical sense of the individuals
she is pursuing this very ambitious project
why because it does not produce
any type of knowledge the
knowledge produced by
socialists are based on
hypotheses one problematic is that
it’s a term that puts you in
run here at sciences po there is
also of course a
investment on a land of
research
and then there are results and this
knowledge that is produced from its purpose
it is the opposite of all these
knowledge that abounds in
social networks and which fall under the
fast-food king or soft thought or
good sense of common sense
why am I telling you this because I
believe we live in a world
paradoxical on one side as I said
we are overwhelmed with information from
diverse and varied knowledge and
done every day we learn from
news yesterday for example by preparing
this intervention day where my page
yahoo and I learn that new
clues of new items on a
presidential candidate of the
republic are going to be quickly and
soon deliver to the public
I also learn that beyoncé grande
new to announce us or yet or
still that the om is looking for its only to
thann
and then in one click we can access
without waiting for the 15 scenes most
hotties of world cinema
but we live in a paradoxical world
because on one side there are all
information that can be accumulated
no problem and then from the other he me
seems and it’s going to be the subject of my
intervention I believe we are
all inclined to what I would call the
refusal to know where the denial even of a
some
reality because his knowledge that we
let’s suck that we’re gobbling it’s rare
that we have them herarchie ions it
is also rare that we found in
this one
the one that makes us advance those who
are the most useful to us but
also I mean to society and this
refusal to know what denial of knowledge is
more widespread than we think
that’s why the formula is so
it’s the streets said that these are the
social networks but that’s the
breeds that’s why the formula of
sapere aude race and dare to know is so
beautiful
of course I wondered
[Music]
views if such had not reversed
meaning of the words know how to dare do more
help you in my opinion but it’s probably
the sign that I had prejudices dared
to know how to dare to know because the knowledge
knowing merit presupposes an effort
of audacity see also a break with
our intellectual comfort the senses
social affairs have the task of
fight against the refusal to know
I could give you a thousand examples
which would illustrate you know them the
sociology for example of education has
shown that democratization
had not diminished the
inequalities and strengthened them
for example the grandes écoles
in particular are Monday but I do not want
do not do that here
karski and told me magically almost
beautiful when you practice the senses
social is that basically we can
work a little bit especially from
when we come to build the
questioning that we propose and me
I wanted to work precisely on the
denial itself from where does this denial of
know how is it feeding and
what form
he takes then I will give you a
example taken from my research I
find that I practice sociology
policy change policy
that is, I’m interested in
democratization process your
revolutionary episodes and then to
what happens thereafter during
a very long time I worked on this
beautiful country that is poland after
the fall of communism and for six years
I chose to transgress a little
boundary between cultural areas n
interested in Tunisia in the
very context of uprising
how is a December 17, 2010 to
sidi bouzid by the immolation of mohamed
bouazizi and one of the issues
immediate it’s not the only one has been
the departure of ben ali
it trivializes on purple background because the
move and and its fetish color
so in this work I’m interested in a
very specific element these are the
elites and the elites not matter
which I’m interested in
whose executives of the old regime
reinvest or not after the
revolution in the bottom what is a
revolution made to the vanquished a
quite defeated revolution disqualified
through history and as part of that
work I was able to work on denial
because I practiced
method of maintenance we do a lot
interviews with a
ministers deputies of governors of
ambassadors 22 prime minister of
the time of ben ali and I was
questioned about issues that to my
opinions are important and
human rights is not without knowing
in tunisia there is an instance
truth the unity that was put in
place in the case of justice
transitional and aimed at making the
light on the crimes of the past
as part of this truth instance
and dignity of public hearings have
been organized and a lot of
victims of the old regime were able to
to testify is presented to the public
this test is transmitted to the
live television the abuses which they
were the victims
torture for example was a
common practice in tunisia
among the sixty thousand records that
the truth and dignity authority has
recorded ten thousand relate to cases
of torture and we can assume that all
those who have been victims of not
did not show up in the
of transitional justice
so I wanted to know what the
figures from the previous regime of the
fallen scheme in think is what he
had doubts of regrets or even
feelings of responsibility
same guilt so I
practiced these interviews by being neither
judge or journalist to understand the
speeches that they were going to give me and
against all odds not only very
very few or none
of them did not recognize a species
shape a few some form
of responsibility but in addition he deny
the facts then what are the forms
of the latter I wanted to restore so
the different ways of the d
and I relied on a book that
you may know that they
are called states of dynario in
which the author distinguishes three types of
deny the denial literal denial
interpretative the denial of implication
neo liberal this did not happen
in vor of torture for example then
I have a case of a former prime minister
who tells me you know how to talk about it
but it was so exaggerated
did not believe in interpretive denial
it means yes it’s true we
recognizes the salhab facts that has it well
took place but that’s not what you
think then an example of denials
interpretative
it’s the idea of minimizing crime or
good to say that basically it is
justifiable when we pursue a
more noble goal for example fight
against Islamism that has been
the flagship argument of the executives of this
ben ali regime and that justified the
cost of abuses against the rights of
the man to hatch this plant
that this beautiful plant that the
democracy one must first know
weeding tells us a former cadre of
left otherwise gardener then
third form of denial the donut
of involvement if the most widespread is
to say yes it’s true torture and
well existed yes that’s right I have everything to
do what you believe it is the
torture but I’m not for nothing a
former cadre for example the party tells me
you know me I was not in
the executive so that’s right I
supported the previous regime
I made speeches I got
wandered all over the country but I did
never put i never took any
decision I never signed a law
or decree and I never gave
order of this type then I’m going to see a
former minister who departed
the executive his minister tells me you
know yes that’s right I participated in
these governments but I was clean
as Minister of Education
so I can be blamed for the decline in
school level but by no means the
fact that torture and could be a
convenient
I’m going to see an old bet
Is not the interior after all the
police chief and he tells me
you know under ben ali the repression
with orchestrated since carthage so
it was president ben ali who took
the decisions
I have absolutely nothing to do with
this whole story
so I wanted to understand where from
came these different types of
rhetoric
I rejected explanations that
seemed too simple the idea of a
universality of denial on the ground that it is
found in our analogous context
the idea also of an approach of a
approach
the idea came from a more
psychological or psychoanalytic that puts
forward the notion of personality
authoritarian it seems to me alas still
that it did not suit and then
last explanation that of a
cultural specificity this idea
was bothering that companies
Arabs are restive to democracy
against human rights and that this
are companies
we’re doing very well with this example
pictorial orientalist these are
societies of intrinsic violence
so I wanted to explain it
differently this denial by putting in
before three or four same factors
which seemed to me much more
significant
first of all simply because the
cadets the old regime have interest in
deny they are still likely
to be prosecuted by justice
secondly because the history of the
repression is not written yet
it is all the interest of
do social sciences or
the story it’s easy for someone to
deny realities as soon as they
have not yet been objective and in
texts of publications sufficiently
recognized by everyone
so we can happily
historical revisionism in the
Tunisian context of today and then
3-1 factor if the context themselves
interviews conducted these interviews
allow games with language that’s
hannah arendt when she is worked
about the eichmann trial which showed that
clichy shots at the bottom
aiming or language rules actually
the accused could defend himself
mobilizing precisely all that the
language allows as potentialities
first 2
to express a number of ideas and
then lately because it seems to me
but the respondent share a
particular social property this
are all executives of an elite
political politicians who claims
the paternity of the modernization of
country that is actually a safe elite
itself
not inclined to self-criticism and whose
the moral economy we say consists
precisely and leads to justify
things that would otherwise be found
unjustifiable why do I
had it all told is well
because it seems to me that we are at
beyond the cases of the old regime of a
country like tunisia
we are all subject to the refusal of
to know we are not always aware
but it seems to me that the analyzes that
I presented on this other
reality are also valid in part
for ourselves the literal denial by
example who knows today who knows
that today in Tunisia torture
continues to be practiced in
police
rousset of tunisia she is
outstanding success of the Arab world
democratization
who became a model several
civil society organizations have
received a Nobel Prize
all that is fine but good
obviously but why these tones more
that that the fact that not only the
torture is practiced but in addition
the judicial system does everything for
prevent charges and does everything
to push lawsuits you deny
interpretative does not happen to you
sometimes give credit to what
justifies the crime or injustice to no
of a nobler goal this old
rhetoric of hunger that would justify
the means is what we are not all
here and brought him to use this
argument
and then the denial of implication that to
my opinion is still the most
widespread does not happen to you as well
easy to deal with a tragic situation of
to say that it is tragic but that there
can I do that but
is not that a way of
overestimate our powerlessness to change
things
is not it a way
also of us involved now
because because basically we too
we have every reason to
to practice denial is for our
interest first for our comfort
moral and intellectual it’s also because
that some indignation does not
have not entered the agenda yet
public are not subject to
media and political treatment and
so we act as if they did not exist
not and then especially the denial of
responsibility seems to me
it is also linked to the fact that we do not
are never in the conditions of a
interview as I was able to do with
former ministers of ben ali
we never have justified at once
our impotence our indifference
vis-à-vis crime and well yes well
obviously neither our
ignorance
so understand me well I said we
I did not say you because my speech is not
no sermon is that here it is
maybe it’s a little TV
evangelist but I was not
absolutely not there for
a sermon sessouma man inclined to denial
I do not know much that I do not know
of course there are realities
that I would not be able to see the same
topics on the cases I would be unable
in my opinion of work and give you I
you showed an image that I do not know
not see they do not arrive at them
watch and I can not seem to
the results
this very hard picture she was taking
August 21, 2013 in the suburbs of
Damascus in the neighborhood of the road to
following a chemical-armed massacre
and the two little girls are dead
of gaza and will be played on the 21 or 2013 of
celebrate my birthday I do not even know
more where very far from the realities
Syrian there is a good chance that I
would be unable to work through
example about mass murders or about
realities as appalling but
I try by the practice of the social senses
to become aware of this from
deconstruct ordinary flavors
unnecessary and to seek
produce unprecedented knowledge that
help me to see the world differently
that’s where my commitment is as
researcher again but also
as a teacher to spread this knowledge
and that’s why this beautiful formula
dare to know me touch too
deeply
thank you very much
[Applause]
”
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