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Giving effectively | Sanjay Joshi | TEDxCourtauldInstitute


have you ever donated to charity and

have you ever donated to charity and wondered what impact has my donation

wondered what impact has my donation

wondered what impact has my donation actually made I’m going to talk you

actually made I’m going to talk you

actually made I’m going to talk you through my journey and exploring that

through my journey and exploring that

through my journey and exploring that question through my experiences in the

question through my experiences in the

question through my experiences in the charity sector through my decision to

charity sector through my decision to

charity sector through my decision to create the only comprehensive database

create the only comprehensive database

create the only comprehensive database of charity impact in the UK and the

of charity impact in the UK and the

of charity impact in the UK and the fascinating insights that came from

fascinating insights that came from

fascinating insights that came from analyzing that data including the

analyzing that data including the

analyzing that data including the realization that not only can all of us

realization that not only can all of us

realization that not only can all of us have a huge impact on people’s lives

have a huge impact on people’s lives

have a huge impact on people’s lives through the directions we make but

through the directions we make but

through the directions we make but through smart giving through being a

through smart giving through being a

through smart giving through being a data-driven donor we can multiply that

data-driven donor we can multiply that

data-driven donor we can multiply that impact by a factor of 100 or even a

impact by a factor of 100 or even a

impact by a factor of 100 or even a thousand first let’s start with the

thousand first let’s start with the

thousand first let’s start with the question when you donate to charity do

question when you donate to charity do

question when you donate to charity do you ever have that feeling that your

you ever have that feeling that your

you ever have that feeling that your money is just going into a black hole

money is just going into a black hole

money is just going into a black hole does it ever feel like I’ve given 10

does it ever feel like I’ve given 10

does it ever feel like I’ve given 10 pounds and all I know now is that I’m

pounds and all I know now is that I’m

pounds and all I know now is that I’m ten pounds poorer I felt like a great

ten pounds poorer I felt like a great

ten pounds poorer I felt like a great way to get to the bottom of this

way to get to the bottom of this

way to get to the bottom of this question was to spend more time with

question was to spend more time with

question was to spend more time with actual charities so I volunteered with

actual charities so I volunteered with

actual charities so I volunteered with several there are lots of anecdotes I

several there are lots of anecdotes I

several there are lots of anecdotes I could tell about my experiences i’m

could tell about my experiences i’m

could tell about my experiences i’m going to choose just one I was

going to choose just one I was

going to choose just one I was volunteering with a phone helpline and

volunteering with a phone helpline and

volunteering with a phone helpline and one particular cool that I got from a

one particular cool that I got from a

one particular cool that I got from a distressed person is one that I don’t

distressed person is one that I don’t

distressed person is one that I don’t think I’ll ever forget that person told

think I’ll ever forget that person told

think I’ll ever forget that person told me about traumas that they’d experienced

me about traumas that they’d experienced

me about traumas that they’d experienced that were so horrific I was in all at

that were so horrific I was in all at

that were so horrific I was in all at that person strength and resilience to

that person strength and resilience to

that person strength and resilience to survive what they had survived I was in

survive what they had survived I was in

survive what they had survived I was in anger at the injustice of a world where

anger at the injustice of a world where

anger at the injustice of a world where something like this could happen when I

something like this could happen when I

something like this could happen when I was next in the branch there was a note

was next in the branch there was a note

was next in the branch there was a note for me that person I’ve been speaking to

for me that person I’ve been speaking to

for me that person I’ve been speaking to had called back and wanted me to know

had called back and wanted me to know

had called back and wanted me to know that through that conversation there had

that through that conversation there had

that through that conversation there had been a connection made

been a connection made

been a connection made it was a turning point and the thing I

it was a turning point and the thing I

it was a turning point and the thing I don’t think I’ll ever forget is that

don’t think I’ll ever forget is that

don’t think I’ll ever forget is that that person was alive today and they

that person was alive today and they

that person was alive today and they wouldn’t have been if I hadn’t been

wouldn’t have been if I hadn’t been

wouldn’t have been if I hadn’t been there I felt really humbled and

there I felt really humbled and

there I felt really humbled and privileged to have had that sort of

privileged to have had that sort of

privileged to have had that sort of impact on the life of somebody who was

impact on the life of somebody who was

impact on the life of somebody who was suicidally despairing and it was through

suicidally despairing and it was through

suicidally despairing and it was through experiences like this one and many

experiences like this one and many

experiences like this one and many others that I came to realize that of

others that I came to realize that of

others that I came to realize that of course the answer is no it’s not a black

course the answer is no it’s not a black

course the answer is no it’s not a black hole when you donate to charity it’s not

hole when you donate to charity it’s not

hole when you donate to charity it’s not just going nowhere that the charity

just going nowhere that the charity

just going nowhere that the charity sector really is having an impact on

sector really is having an impact on

sector really is having an impact on people’s lives that it is really making

people’s lives that it is really making

people’s lives that it is really making people’s lives better so why was it that

people’s lives better so why was it that

people’s lives better so why was it that for me as a charity donor I still felt

for me as a charity donor I still felt

for me as a charity donor I still felt dissatisfied with this answer I thought

dissatisfied with this answer I thought

dissatisfied with this answer I thought about it’s more and at the time I was

about it’s more and at the time I was

about it’s more and at the time I was working in finance I was crunching data

working in finance I was crunching data

working in finance I was crunching data on companies and helping investors to

on companies and helping investors to

on companies and helping investors to optimize their outcomes for their

optimize their outcomes for their

optimize their outcomes for their portfolios um and I was wondering is

portfolios um and I was wondering is

portfolios um and I was wondering is this some way that i can use data

this some way that i can use data

this some way that i can use data analysis to help me to make better

analysis to help me to make better

analysis to help me to make better charitable giving decisions so that I’m

charitable giving decisions so that I’m

charitable giving decisions so that I’m not just trying to answer the question

not just trying to answer the question

not just trying to answer the question am i giving to a charity that does

am i giving to a charity that does

am i giving to a charity that does something and not nothing but rather to

something and not nothing but rather to

something and not nothing but rather to try and do the most good i can with the

try and do the most good i can with the

try and do the most good i can with the donations that I’m making when I was

donations that I’m making when I was

donations that I’m making when I was thinking about this there was one idea

thinking about this there was one idea

thinking about this there was one idea that seemed really seductive I thought

that seemed really seductive I thought

that seemed really seductive I thought why don’t we get all of the charities

why don’t we get all of the charities

why don’t we get all of the charities list them out and rank them according to

list them out and rank them according to

list them out and rank them according to how much they spend on admin or how much

how much they spend on admin or how much

how much they spend on admin or how much they spend on overheads this seemed

they spend on overheads this seemed

they spend on overheads this seemed really promising but I’d also seen

really promising but I’d also seen

really promising but I’d also seen through my experiences in the charity

through my experiences in the charity

through my experiences in the charity sector from being a trustee of many

sector from being a trustee of many

sector from being a trustee of many charities I realized that actually this

charities I realized that actually this

charities I realized that actually this was not going to work I discovered that

was not going to work I discovered that

was not going to work I discovered that admin expenses as a ratio give you a

admin expenses as a ratio give you a

admin expenses as a ratio give you a full sense of efficiency and a full

full sense of efficiency and a full

full sense of efficiency and a full sense of transparency for example

sense of transparency for example

sense of transparency for example imagine you have the start off

imagine you have the start off

imagine you have the start off complement of a

complement of a

complement of a and then you take out the admin stuff

and then you take out the admin stuff

and then you take out the admin stuff what happens well the admin work doesn’t

what happens well the admin work doesn’t

what happens well the admin work doesn’t go away and so it means that the

go away and so it means that the

go away and so it means that the remaining staff possibly more qualified

remaining staff possibly more qualified

remaining staff possibly more qualified staff end up picking up the remaining

staff end up picking up the remaining

staff end up picking up the remaining work by focusing on lower admin we might

work by focusing on lower admin we might

work by focusing on lower admin we might not be making a charity more efficient

not be making a charity more efficient

not be making a charity more efficient we might be making them less efficient

we might be making them less efficient

we might be making them less efficient also there’s no hard and fast rule about

also there’s no hard and fast rule about

also there’s no hard and fast rule about what is admin and what isn’t admin so by

what is admin and what isn’t admin so by

what is admin and what isn’t admin so by optimizing for the lowest admin costs we

optimizing for the lowest admin costs we

optimizing for the lowest admin costs we might actually just be choosing a

might actually just be choosing a

might actually just be choosing a charity that classified expenses in one

charity that classified expenses in one

charity that classified expenses in one way rather than another way and this is

way rather than another way and this is

way rather than another way and this is actually not what we’re interested in at

actually not what we’re interested in at

actually not what we’re interested in at all so admin expenses overheads this I

all so admin expenses overheads this I

all so admin expenses overheads this I realized it’s not helping us inspiration

realized it’s not helping us inspiration

realized it’s not helping us inspiration came for what might be useful when I was

came for what might be useful when I was

came for what might be useful when I was buying a mobile phone it was an

buying a mobile phone it was an

buying a mobile phone it was an important decision and there are lots of

important decision and there are lots of

important decision and there are lots of questions to ask but I realized at no

questions to ask but I realized at no

questions to ask but I realized at no point was i asking but how much is

point was i asking but how much is

point was i asking but how much is Samson’s CEO paid how much does Apple

Samson’s CEO paid how much does Apple

Samson’s CEO paid how much does Apple spend on admin there were lots of

spend on admin there were lots of

spend on admin there were lots of questions that I did ask and they

questions that I did ask and they

questions that I did ask and they followed a pattern how much does the

followed a pattern how much does the

followed a pattern how much does the phone cost what do i get for my money i

phone cost what do i get for my money i

phone cost what do i get for my money i wondered could this be a framework for

wondered could this be a framework for

wondered could this be a framework for thinking about charitable giving too is

thinking about charitable giving too is

thinking about charitable giving too is there an appetite amongst donors for

there an appetite amongst donors for

there an appetite amongst donors for thinking in this way well clearly to

thinking in this way well clearly to

thinking in this way well clearly to some extent there must be because some

some extent there must be because some

some extent there must be because some charities are already using this source

charities are already using this source

charities are already using this source of language in their marketing is the

of language in their marketing is the

of language in their marketing is the data available well I’m very familiar

data available well I’m very familiar

data available well I’m very familiar with the charity sector I’ve know how

with the charity sector I’ve know how

with the charity sector I’ve know how charities put together their reports and

charities put together their reports and

charities put together their reports and where they go and I had to look around

where they go and I had to look around

where they go and I had to look around and I found that even outside of that

and I found that even outside of that

and I found that even outside of that minority of charities that communicate

minority of charities that communicate

minority of charities that communicate in this way the answer is yes there is

in this way the answer is yes there is

in this way the answer is yes there is charity impact data out there not always

charity impact data out there not always

charity impact data out there not always for every charity not always to the same

for every charity not always to the same

for every charity not always to the same level of detail and standards that I’d

level of detail and standards that I’d

level of detail and standards that I’d like but yes there is charity impact

like but yes there is charity impact

like but yes there is charity impact data out there in the public domain on

data out there in the public domain on

data out there in the public domain on the internet was there anybody who was

the internet was there anybody who was

the internet was there anybody who was already taking all of the data that’s

already taking all of the data that’s

already taking all of the data that’s out there and putting it together in

out there and putting it together in

out there and putting it together in one nice structured place where it can

one nice structured place where it can

one nice structured place where it can be analyzed and used there wasn’t my

be analyzed and used there wasn’t my

be analyzed and used there wasn’t my project started just with me and a

project started just with me and a

project started just with me and a spreadsheet on Saturday afternoons or in

spreadsheet on Saturday afternoons or in

spreadsheet on Saturday afternoons or in evenings going around on the internet

evenings going around on the internet

evenings going around on the internet picking up data putting it in there

picking up data putting it in there

picking up data putting it in there after I got to almost a hundred

after I got to almost a hundred

after I got to almost a hundred charities I started to analyze and

charities I started to analyze and

charities I started to analyze and understand the data more and some really

understand the data more and some really

understand the data more and some really interesting stuff came out of that in

interesting stuff came out of that in

interesting stuff came out of that in this chart each dot represents one

this chart each dot represents one

this chart each dot represents one charity so for example that dot in the

charity so for example that dot in the

charity so for example that dot in the middle there is nay pack the National

middle there is nay pack the National

middle there is nay pack the National Association for people abused in

Association for people abused in

Association for people abused in childhood in this case I’ve actually met

childhood in this case I’ve actually met

childhood in this case I’ve actually met with the management team of that charity

with the management team of that charity

with the management team of that charity and I can vouch for the fact that these

and I can vouch for the fact that these

and I can vouch for the fact that these guys are smart credible they really know

guys are smart credible they really know

guys are smart credible they really know what they’re talking about in this up in

what they’re talking about in this up in

what they’re talking about in this up in their subject area one of the volunteers

their subject area one of the volunteers

their subject area one of the volunteers in this project has gathered data on

in this project has gathered data on

in this project has gathered data on this charity and based on that I’d

this charity and based on that I’d

this charity and based on that I’d estimate that if you can donate a

estimate that if you can donate a

estimate that if you can donate a hundred pounds to this charity for

hundred pounds to this charity for

hundred pounds to this charity for example maybe you donate ten pounds a

example maybe you donate ten pounds a

example maybe you donate ten pounds a month for almost a year then you funded

month for almost a year then you funded

month for almost a year then you funded them enough to enable one person to get

them enough to enable one person to get

them enough to enable one person to get access to their services via their phone

access to their services via their phone

access to their services via their phone helpline I phone helpline not dissimilar

helpline I phone helpline not dissimilar

helpline I phone helpline not dissimilar to the one that I volunteered on myself

to the one that I volunteered on myself

to the one that I volunteered on myself and if you do that you’ve done something

and if you do that you’ve done something

and if you do that you’ve done something really awesome you’ve enabled someone to

really awesome you’ve enabled someone to

really awesome you’ve enabled someone to get access to something that might be

get access to something that might be

get access to something that might be really useful information or it might be

really useful information or it might be

really useful information or it might be an extraordinary transformative

an extraordinary transformative

an extraordinary transformative life-changing event and if you’ve done

life-changing event and if you’ve done

life-changing event and if you’ve done that that’s amazing and I’d really like

that that’s amazing and I’d really like

that that’s amazing and I’d really like to congratulate you for that the real

to congratulate you for that the real

to congratulate you for that the real opportunity comes when we use the data

opportunity comes when we use the data

opportunity comes when we use the data to explore the rest of the charity space

remember earlier I said there were two

remember earlier I said there were two questions we were interested in one of

questions we were interested in one of

questions we were interested in one of them is how much does it cost to achieve

them is how much does it cost to achieve

them is how much does it cost to achieve a charitable outcome a vaccination a

a charitable outcome a vaccination a

a charitable outcome a vaccination a child educated or whatever and what do

child educated or whatever and what do

child educated or whatever and what do we get for our money how much good does

we get for our money how much good does

we get for our money how much good does that outcome create and that’s what

that outcome create and that’s what

that outcome create and that’s what these two axes represent the x-axis over

these two axes represent the x-axis over

these two axes represent the x-axis over here is how much does it cost

here is how much does it cost

here is how much does it cost if you go further to the right it

if you go further to the right it

if you go further to the right it becomes cheaper and the y-axis is an

becomes cheaper and the y-axis is an

becomes cheaper and the y-axis is an estimate of how much good is done /

estimate of how much good is done /

estimate of how much good is done / thing funded let’s look at another one

thing funded let’s look at another one

thing funded let’s look at another one of these dots this dot over here which

of these dots this dot over here which

of these dots this dot over here which it should be slightly to the left sorry

it should be slightly to the left sorry

it should be slightly to the left sorry slide to the right represents SC I

slide to the right represents SC I

slide to the right represents SC I there’s just the samaya sysctl

there’s just the samaya sysctl

there’s just the samaya sysctl initiative this is a charity that treats

initiative this is a charity that treats

initiative this is a charity that treats people mostly in Africa for a parasitic

people mostly in Africa for a parasitic

people mostly in Africa for a parasitic got disease these treatments enable

got disease these treatments enable

got disease these treatments enable people to to not have this disease

people to to not have this disease

people to to not have this disease anymore which obviously has a clear

anymore which obviously has a clear

anymore which obviously has a clear impact on the well-being and there’s

impact on the well-being and there’s

impact on the well-being and there’s also a number of subtle and robustly

also a number of subtle and robustly

also a number of subtle and robustly tested impacts on education and income

tested impacts on education and income

tested impacts on education and income in later life it’s also a really

in later life it’s also a really

in later life it’s also a really reliable and consistent treatment the

reliable and consistent treatment the

reliable and consistent treatment the fascinating thing is that this is

fascinating thing is that this is

fascinating thing is that this is incredibly inexpensive taking into

incredibly inexpensive taking into

incredibly inexpensive taking into account all of the costs transport

account all of the costs transport

account all of the costs transport warehousing admin everything the total

warehousing admin everything the total

warehousing admin everything the total cost to get to just one person is under

cost to get to just one person is under

cost to get to just one person is under a pound which means that if you’re

a pound which means that if you’re

a pound which means that if you’re donating ten pounds a month for a year

donating ten pounds a month for a year

donating ten pounds a month for a year over a hundred people get access to this

over a hundred people get access to this

over a hundred people get access to this treatment I thought would charity donors

treatment I thought would charity donors

treatment I thought would charity donors not want to have access to this sort of

not want to have access to this sort of

not want to have access to this sort of data when they’re donating would you as

data when they’re donating would you as

data when they’re donating would you as a donor not want to know for the amount

a donor not want to know for the amount

a donor not want to know for the amount that I’m donating to this charity I

that I’m donating to this charity I

that I’m donating to this charity I might reach one person or by choosing a

might reach one person or by choosing a

might reach one person or by choosing a different charity the same money might

different charity the same money might

different charity the same money might help three people or 10 people or a

help three people or 10 people or a

help three people or 10 people or a hundred people or a thousand people and

hundred people or a thousand people and

hundred people or a thousand people and would you not want to know what is the

would you not want to know what is the

would you not want to know what is the impact that’s having on a per person

impact that’s having on a per person

impact that’s having on a per person basis to know whether reaching a

basis to know whether reaching a

basis to know whether reaching a thousand times more people is having a

thousand times more people is having a

thousand times more people is having a thousand times more impact these

thousand times more impact these

thousand times more impact these questions inspired me to create so give

questions inspired me to create so give

questions inspired me to create so give a not-for-profit social enterprise which

a not-for-profit social enterprise which

a not-for-profit social enterprise which is creating an online giving platform

is creating an online giving platform

is creating an online giving platform where you can make donations to

where you can make donations to

where you can make donations to charities online and you can

charities online and you can

charities online and you can have access to this data so that you can

have access to this data so that you can

have access to this data so that you can make smart giving decisions and have

make smart giving decisions and have

make smart giving decisions and have hundreds or thousands of times more

hundreds or thousands of times more

hundreds or thousands of times more impact and when you’ve donated to a

impact and when you’ve donated to a

impact and when you’ve donated to a charity you can see not just what does

charity you can see not just what does

charity you can see not just what does the charity do but how much of that

the charity do but how much of that

the charity do but how much of that chart is impact is attributable to me

chart is impact is attributable to me

chart is impact is attributable to me the donor in my donations I believe that

the donor in my donations I believe that

the donor in my donations I believe that the potential here is huge I believe

the potential here is huge I believe

the potential here is huge I believe that there’s a possibility that people

that there’s a possibility that people

that there’s a possibility that people will say now that I can see how much

will say now that I can see how much

will say now that I can see how much impact I’m having I feel motivated to

impact I’m having I feel motivated to

impact I’m having I feel motivated to give more there’s a possibility that

give more there’s a possibility that

give more there’s a possibility that people will say now that I can express

people will say now that I can express

people will say now that I can express my donations in terms that are

my donations in terms that are

my donations in terms that are meaningful to me I feel more comfortable

meaningful to me I feel more comfortable

meaningful to me I feel more comfortable sharing them online we can have more

sharing them online we can have more

sharing them online we can have more virality of of charitable giving and I

virality of of charitable giving and I

virality of of charitable giving and I believe that it’s possible that through

believe that it’s possible that through

believe that it’s possible that through this mechanism we can become data-driven

this mechanism we can become data-driven

this mechanism we can become data-driven donors and as data-driven donors we can

donors and as data-driven donors we can

donors and as data-driven donors we can have a huge extra impact on people’s

have a huge extra impact on people’s

have a huge extra impact on people’s lives hundreds of times more impact

lives hundreds of times more impact

lives hundreds of times more impact thousands of times more impact not even

thousands of times more impact not even

thousands of times more impact not even without having to give more to charity

without having to give more to charity

without having to give more to charity so I would encourage you if you also

so I would encourage you if you also

so I would encourage you if you also would like to be a data-driven donor

would like to be a data-driven donor

would like to be a data-driven donor visit so give dot org sign up it only

visit so give dot org sign up it only

visit so give dot org sign up it only takes a moment we’re at the early stages

takes a moment we’re at the early stages

takes a moment we’re at the early stages we’re building momentum and we would

we’re building momentum and we would

we’re building momentum and we would like to see a change in the world thank

like to see a change in the world thank

like to see a change in the world thank you

”

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