more than 20 years ago I was hiking the Continental Divide
Continental Divide
Continental Divide it was very remote and there was known
it was very remote and there was known
it was very remote and there was known around except for one man one horse and
around except for one man one horse and
around except for one man one horse and a whole lot of sheep and he approached
a whole lot of sheep and he approached
a whole lot of sheep and he approached me and since he’d been alone up there
me and since he’d been alone up there
me and since he’d been alone up there all summer he was very eager to talk and
all summer he was very eager to talk and
all summer he was very eager to talk and I was eager to talk to him as well but
I was eager to talk to him as well but
I was eager to talk to him as well but the only problem was that he was from
the only problem was that he was from
the only problem was that he was from Mexico and only spoke Spanish and I had
Mexico and only spoke Spanish and I had
Mexico and only spoke Spanish and I had taken French and Latin in high school
taken French and Latin in high school
taken French and Latin in high school and it occurred to me that there was
and it occurred to me that there was
and it occurred to me that there was something rather sad and and and absurd
something rather sad and and and absurd
something rather sad and and and absurd about the idea that I was in my own
about the idea that I was in my own
about the idea that I was in my own country in a place where there were no
country in a place where there were no
country in a place where there were no people and the one person there you know
people and the one person there you know
people and the one person there you know we couldn’t communicate and so I decided
we couldn’t communicate and so I decided
we couldn’t communicate and so I decided then that I wanted to learn Spanish and
then that I wanted to learn Spanish and
then that I wanted to learn Spanish and so over the course of the next several
so over the course of the next several
so over the course of the next several years I traveled to several Latin
years I traveled to several Latin
years I traveled to several Latin American countries I took some classes
American countries I took some classes
American countries I took some classes and in the course of this I found myself
and in the course of this I found myself
and in the course of this I found myself in Bolivia and I was on a bus trip in a
in Bolivia and I was on a bus trip in a
in Bolivia and I was on a bus trip in a remote area and the bus broke down and
remote area and the bus broke down and
remote area and the bus broke down and it was serious enough that they told us
it was serious enough that they told us
it was serious enough that they told us to get off which is never a good sign
to get off which is never a good sign
to get off which is never a good sign and so as all the passengers were
and so as all the passengers were
and so as all the passengers were standing there on the side of the road
standing there on the side of the road
standing there on the side of the road these women in traditional dress came
these women in traditional dress came
these women in traditional dress came out of the mountains and opened up these
out of the mountains and opened up these
out of the mountains and opened up these big colorful blankets onto the ground
big colorful blankets onto the ground
big colorful blankets onto the ground and they began slicing chicken and
and they began slicing chicken and
and they began slicing chicken and cutting avocados and slicing bread and
cutting avocados and slicing bread and
cutting avocados and slicing bread and making sandwiches and they sold these
making sandwiches and they sold these
making sandwiches and they sold these sandwiches to the passengers including
sandwiches to the passengers including
sandwiches to the passengers including me and of course they did a brisk
me and of course they did a brisk
me and of course they did a brisk business because you know there’s no
business because you know there’s no
business because you know there’s no better customer than someone stuck in
better customer than someone stuck in
better customer than someone stuck in the middle of nowhere on a broken bus
the middle of nowhere on a broken bus
the middle of nowhere on a broken bus and but it struck me then that you know
and but it struck me then that you know
and but it struck me then that you know capitalism was so much more than I
capitalism was so much more than I
capitalism was so much more than I thought it was I had always thought that
thought it was I had always thought that
thought it was I had always thought that capitalism was the men in suits rushing
capitalism was the men in suits rushing
capitalism was the men in suits rushing for the train to Wall Street that I used
for the train to Wall Street that I used
for the train to Wall Street that I used to see when I was a boy in New Jersey
to see when I was a boy in New Jersey
to see when I was a boy in New Jersey and I thought capitalism was the number
and I thought capitalism was the number
and I thought capitalism was the number that goes along the bottom of the screen
that goes along the bottom of the screen
that goes along the bottom of the screen for the Dow or the S&P but I realized
for the Dow or the S&P but I realized
for the Dow or the S&P but I realized then that this was a much truer and
then that this was a much truer and
then that this was a much truer and deeper form of capitalism and it struck
deeper form of capitalism and it struck
deeper form of capitalism and it struck me that if this could be harnessed
me that if this could be harnessed
me that if this could be harnessed somehow that the energy and creativity
somehow that the energy and creativity
somehow that the energy and creativity of these women selling sandwiches could
of these women selling sandwiches could
of these women selling sandwiches could be applied to something else then
be applied to something else then
be applied to something else then there’s no telling what could be
there’s no telling what could be
there’s no telling what could be accomplished and so a few years later I
accomplished and so a few years later I
accomplished and so a few years later I became acquainted with Kiva in fact they
became acquainted with Kiva in fact they
became acquainted with Kiva in fact they were not even founded until right around
were not even founded until right around
were not even founded until right around the time that I got acquainted
and I was attracted to it for these
and I was attracted to it for these three basic reasons the first one is
three basic reasons the first one is
three basic reasons the first one is that it’s not a gift it’s a loan and so
that it’s not a gift it’s a loan and so
that it’s not a gift it’s a loan and so it encourages both the lender and the
it encourages both the lender and the
it encourages both the lender and the borrower to take it seriously and it can
borrower to take it seriously and it can
borrower to take it seriously and it can be repeated and then the second point
be repeated and then the second point
be repeated and then the second point which is maybe most important to this
which is maybe most important to this
which is maybe most important to this presentation and maybe most important
presentation and maybe most important
presentation and maybe most important overall is that you had the opportunity
overall is that you had the opportunity
overall is that you had the opportunity to read about and see a picture of your
to read about and see a picture of your
to read about and see a picture of your borrower if you’re the lender and back
borrower if you’re the lender and back
borrower if you’re the lender and back in 2006 that seemed even more amazing
in 2006 that seemed even more amazing
in 2006 that seemed even more amazing than it does now but the point is that
than it does now but the point is that
than it does now but the point is that with most charity you just don’t know
with most charity you just don’t know
with most charity you just don’t know exactly where your money’s going
exactly where your money’s going
exactly where your money’s going but with Kiva you can literally put a
but with Kiva you can literally put a
but with Kiva you can literally put a face to every dollar and then finally
face to every dollar and then finally
face to every dollar and then finally it’s a small very efficient organization
it’s a small very efficient organization
it’s a small very efficient organization and all of your money goes exactly where
and all of your money goes exactly where
and all of your money goes exactly where you want it to go so the basic idea is
you want it to go so the basic idea is
you want it to go so the basic idea is you go on the website and you pick a
you go on the website and you pick a
you go on the website and you pick a borrower and you can sort them based on
borrower and you can sort them based on
borrower and you can sort them based on country and occupation and environmental
country and occupation and environmental
country and occupation and environmental criteria and gender and all sorts of
criteria and gender and all sorts of
criteria and gender and all sorts of things and then you make a loan of $25
things and then you make a loan of $25
things and then you make a loan of $25 or more and then you wait some months or
or more and then you wait some months or
or more and then you wait some months or perhaps a couple of years and you get
perhaps a couple of years and you get
perhaps a couple of years and you get the money back and then you can either
the money back and then you can either
the money back and then you can either keep it or hopefully you can send it
keep it or hopefully you can send it
keep it or hopefully you can send it back on to the website again and pick a
back on to the website again and pick a
back on to the website again and pick a different borrower and then if you like
different borrower and then if you like
different borrower and then if you like you can just repeat this cycle so if we
you can just repeat this cycle so if we
you can just repeat this cycle so if we take a look at my own lending page from
take a look at my own lending page from
take a look at my own lending page from a couple years ago I want you to notice
a couple years ago I want you to notice
a couple years ago I want you to notice there’s a lot of information there but I
there’s a lot of information there but I
there’s a lot of information there but I mainly want you to notice the part that
mainly want you to notice the part that
mainly want you to notice the part that circled in red which is the number of
circled in red which is the number of
circled in red which is the number of deposits and the number of loans so up
deposits and the number of loans so up
deposits and the number of loans so up until this point I had only ever spent
until this point I had only ever spent
until this point I had only ever spent approximately $250 of real money and yet
approximately $250 of real money and yet
approximately $250 of real money and yet I’ve been able to lend a little over a
I’ve been able to lend a little over a
I’ve been able to lend a little over a thousand dollars so that’s essentially a
thousand dollars so that’s essentially a
thousand dollars so that’s essentially a five to one gain and if you’re a person
five to one gain and if you’re a person
five to one gain and if you’re a person of modest means like a teacher it’s nice
of modest means like a teacher it’s nice
of modest means like a teacher it’s nice to think that you can do a little bit
to think that you can do a little bit
to think that you can do a little bit more with your money and so a year and a
more with your money and so a year and a
more with your money and so a year and a half ago I got this amazing opportunity
half ago I got this amazing opportunity
half ago I got this amazing opportunity to go on sabbatical and to become a Kiva
to go on sabbatical and to become a Kiva
to go on sabbatical and to become a Kiva fellow which meant spending four months
fellow which meant spending four months
fellow which meant spending four months or so in Peru and Ecuador and there are
or so in Peru and Ecuador and there are
or so in Peru and Ecuador and there are a lot of wonderful things that happen on
a lot of wonderful things that happen on
a lot of wonderful things that happen on this trip but the important one for this
this trip but the important one for this
this trip but the important one for this discussion is what I call the Wizard of
discussion is what I call the Wizard of
discussion is what I call the Wizard of Oz moment and what I mean by that is
Oz moment and what I mean by that is
Oz moment and what I mean by that is that as wonderful as the write ups of
that as wonderful as the write ups of
that as wonderful as the write ups of the borrower’s are on the web page when
the borrower’s are on the web page when
the borrower’s are on the web page when you actually get to meet
you actually get to meet
you actually get to meet of them you realize that there’s even
of them you realize that there’s even
of them you realize that there’s even more to it than that
more to it than that
more to it than that and so to illustrate that this is
and so to illustrate that this is
and so to illustrate that this is Victoria Mendoza and I met her
Victoria Mendoza and I met her
Victoria Mendoza and I met her eventually while I read her profile this
eventually while I read her profile this
eventually while I read her profile this is what you would see if you saw her on
is what you would see if you saw her on
is what you would see if you saw her on the website and so it’s great I mean you
the website and so it’s great I mean you
the website and so it’s great I mean you get a picture you get some really good
get a picture you get some really good
get a picture you get some really good information but I actually got to meet
information but I actually got to meet
information but I actually got to meet her and when I met her in person this is
her and when I met her in person this is
her and when I met her in person this is a picture that I took of her in her shop
a picture that I took of her in her shop
a picture that I took of her in her shop and you can already start to get a sense
and you can already start to get a sense
and you can already start to get a sense that there’s a lot more going on than
that there’s a lot more going on than
that there’s a lot more going on than the website necessarily you know
the website necessarily you know
the website necessarily you know revealed and then I got to talk to her
revealed and then I got to talk to her
revealed and then I got to talk to her and so on and so the italicized portions
and so on and so the italicized portions
and so on and so the italicized portions there are what it said on the website
there are what it said on the website
there are what it said on the website and that’s great
and that’s great
and that’s great and it gives you an idea of who she is
and it gives you an idea of who she is
and it gives you an idea of who she is but hopefully those are things that
but hopefully those are things that
but hopefully those are things that almost any borrower would say or you
almost any borrower would say or you
almost any borrower would say or you know the would fit almost any any
know the would fit almost any any
know the would fit almost any any borrower but when I talked to her she
borrower but when I talked to her she
borrower but when I talked to her she told me in person the part of the bottom
told me in person the part of the bottom
told me in person the part of the bottom everything I’ve accomplished has been
everything I’ve accomplished has been
everything I’ve accomplished has been for my son and when she said that you
for my son and when she said that you
for my son and when she said that you know suddenly she became much more of an
know suddenly she became much more of an
know suddenly she became much more of an individual and much more of a human to
individual and much more of a human to
individual and much more of a human to me and I realized that that’s where the
me and I realized that that’s where the
me and I realized that that’s where the empathy really starts to kick in is when
empathy really starts to kick in is when
empathy really starts to kick in is when you actually meet the person so it’s
you actually meet the person so it’s
you actually meet the person so it’s nice to see them on the website but it’s
nice to see them on the website but it’s
nice to see them on the website but it’s even more when you meet them in person
even more when you meet them in person
even more when you meet them in person so I would like to share just a couple
so I would like to share just a couple
so I would like to share just a couple more pictures and quotes from a couple
more pictures and quotes from a couple
more pictures and quotes from a couple of other borrowers to illustrate this
of other borrowers to illustrate this
of other borrowers to illustrate this point of how people can really come
point of how people can really come
point of how people can really come alive in various ways so this is
alive in various ways so this is
alive in various ways so this is dionisio and he is a coffee grower and
dionisio and he is a coffee grower and
dionisio and he is a coffee grower and he says a plant is like a Christian and
he says a plant is like a Christian and
he says a plant is like a Christian and this one really struck me because I’ve
this one really struck me because I’ve
this one really struck me because I’ve done a lot of gardening myself but I
done a lot of gardening myself but I
done a lot of gardening myself but I honestly never thought of it this way
honestly never thought of it this way
honestly never thought of it this way but for him apparently you know plants
but for him apparently you know plants
but for him apparently you know plants it’s almost like a religious experience
it’s almost like a religious experience
it’s almost like a religious experience and I thought what a great way to look
and I thought what a great way to look
and I thought what a great way to look at at agriculture and sometimes the
at at agriculture and sometimes the
at at agriculture and sometimes the Bowers are just fun and they don’t
Bowers are just fun and they don’t
Bowers are just fun and they don’t necessarily impart wisdom so much as
necessarily impart wisdom so much as
necessarily impart wisdom so much as they just you know want to have a good
they just you know want to have a good
they just you know want to have a good time with you and so you can see from
time with you and so you can see from
time with you and so you can see from his smile and from what he says that
his smile and from what he says that
his smile and from what he says that Wilmer was just one of those people that
Wilmer was just one of those people that
Wilmer was just one of those people that was just fun and I think that’s an
was just fun and I think that’s an
was just fun and I think that’s an important thing to remember too and then
important thing to remember too and then
important thing to remember too and then I always like to include this one of
I always like to include this one of
I always like to include this one of midian because I think we tend to
midian because I think we tend to
midian because I think we tend to romanticize poverty sometimes a little
romanticize poverty sometimes a little
romanticize poverty sometimes a little bit and I think that it’s important to
bit and I think that it’s important to
bit and I think that it’s important to get past that and so I think she really
get past that and so I think she really
get past that and so I think she really tells us both sides of it on the one
tells us both sides of it on the one
tells us both sides of it on the one hand she’s happy with her
hand she’s happy with her
hand she’s happy with her situation she’s not complaining she’s
situation she’s not complaining she’s
situation she’s not complaining she’s not asking it for pity but on the other
not asking it for pity but on the other
not asking it for pity but on the other hand she recognizes that it could be
hand she recognizes that it could be
hand she recognizes that it could be better and she would like to be better
better and she would like to be better
better and she would like to be better for her children when I started on this
for her children when I started on this
for her children when I started on this project people asked me this question
project people asked me this question
project people asked me this question what does microfinance have to do with
what does microfinance have to do with
what does microfinance have to do with teaching English and I honestly didn’t
teaching English and I honestly didn’t
teaching English and I honestly didn’t have an answer I just thought that there
have an answer I just thought that there
have an answer I just thought that there were two different things that I cared
were two different things that I cared
were two different things that I cared about and so I wanted to be able to do
about and so I wanted to be able to do
about and so I wanted to be able to do both of them if I could but they were
both of them if I could but they were
both of them if I could but they were sort of on parallel tracks and then as
sort of on parallel tracks and then as
sort of on parallel tracks and then as part of the Kiva fellowship I had to do
part of the Kiva fellowship I had to do
part of the Kiva fellowship I had to do a training in San Francisco and during
a training in San Francisco and during
a training in San Francisco and during that training I had this sort of
that training I had this sort of
that training I had this sort of Epiphany and I realized that there is in
Epiphany and I realized that there is in
Epiphany and I realized that there is in fact a connection and the connection is
fact a connection and the connection is
fact a connection and the connection is the Kiva is where a good story can
the Kiva is where a good story can
the Kiva is where a good story can change a life and of course stories are
change a life and of course stories are
change a life and of course stories are what English teachers are preoccupied
what English teachers are preoccupied
what English teachers are preoccupied with and so I don’t know if students
with and so I don’t know if students
with and so I don’t know if students always appreciate this but the reason
always appreciate this but the reason
always appreciate this but the reason that we make you read things that you
that we make you read things that you
that we make you read things that you may not always want to read is I think
may not always want to read is I think
may not always want to read is I think mostly to get at that sense of empathy
mostly to get at that sense of empathy
mostly to get at that sense of empathy of course we want you to write well and
of course we want you to write well and
of course we want you to write well and do all those other things but the books
do all those other things but the books
do all those other things but the books that you encounter in English class tend
that you encounter in English class tend
that you encounter in English class tend to tell you stories about other people
to tell you stories about other people
to tell you stories about other people just as the website of Kiva tells you
just as the website of Kiva tells you
just as the website of Kiva tells you stories about other people and so
stories about other people and so
stories about other people and so stories of course are composed of
stories of course are composed of
stories of course are composed of sentences and what I find remarkable
sentences and what I find remarkable
sentences and what I find remarkable about a lot of material on Kiva is that
about a lot of material on Kiva is that
about a lot of material on Kiva is that there’s nothing fancy about it it’s just
there’s nothing fancy about it it’s just
there’s nothing fancy about it it’s just a very simple statement about a person
a very simple statement about a person
a very simple statement about a person and yet I think that can be one of the
and yet I think that can be one of the
and yet I think that can be one of the best ways of bridging some of the gaps
best ways of bridging some of the gaps
best ways of bridging some of the gaps that we have whether it’s distance or
that we have whether it’s distance or
that we have whether it’s distance or other things we have all heard about a
other things we have all heard about a
other things we have all heard about a lot of the bad things that are going on
lot of the bad things that are going on
lot of the bad things that are going on in the world and I think that really
in the world and I think that really
in the world and I think that really sometimes maybe we focus a little too
sometimes maybe we focus a little too
sometimes maybe we focus a little too much on this because in my experience
much on this because in my experience
much on this because in my experience having traveled to over 50 countries
having traveled to over 50 countries
having traveled to over 50 countries there’s a tremendous amount of hope and
there’s a tremendous amount of hope and
there’s a tremendous amount of hope and of course there is despair as well but
of course there is despair as well but
of course there is despair as well but when you look at statistics like this I
when you look at statistics like this I
when you look at statistics like this I think it can be a little bit misleading
think it can be a little bit misleading
think it can be a little bit misleading and when you hear stories on the other
and when you hear stories on the other
and when you hear stories on the other hand and you look at people like this
hand and you look at people like this
hand and you look at people like this and you meet them if you’re lucky you
and you meet them if you’re lucky you
and you meet them if you’re lucky you start to realize that there’s another
start to realize that there’s another
start to realize that there’s another side of it and so people that are
side of it and so people that are
side of it and so people that are separated by all these things you just
separated by all these things you just
separated by all these things you just sometimes takes only a sentence or two
sometimes takes only a sentence or two
sometimes takes only a sentence or two to bridge that gap so I just picked
to bridge that gap so I just picked
to bridge that gap so I just picked these three sentences as examples of
these three sentences as examples of
these three sentences as examples of what I’m trying to talk about here and
what I’m trying to talk about here and
what I’m trying to talk about here and these are sentences that appeared on the
these are sentences that appeared on the
these are sentences that appeared on the Kiva website
Kiva website
Kiva website and so the first one is about delivering
and so the first one is about delivering
and so the first one is about delivering bread on a bicycle and I just think that
bread on a bicycle and I just think that
bread on a bicycle and I just think that that’s kind of a reminder of sort of the
that’s kind of a reminder of sort of the
that’s kind of a reminder of sort of the mechanics of life that people have to
mechanics of life that people have to
mechanics of life that people have to deal with sometimes maybe in some sense
deal with sometimes maybe in some sense
deal with sometimes maybe in some sense that’s a nicer way to do it but it’s
that’s a nicer way to do it but it’s
that’s a nicer way to do it but it’s certainly not an easier way to do it and
certainly not an easier way to do it and
certainly not an easier way to do it and so I think when you read a sentence like
so I think when you read a sentence like
so I think when you read a sentence like that from our perspective in the u.s. it
that from our perspective in the u.s. it
that from our perspective in the u.s. it really makes you think about a different
really makes you think about a different
really makes you think about a different different life and then the second
different life and then the second
different life and then the second example is about a woman who has many
example is about a woman who has many
example is about a woman who has many difficulties of her own and many
difficulties of her own and many
difficulties of her own and many children to care for and yet she’s
children to care for and yet she’s
children to care for and yet she’s voluntarily taking on extra people extra
voluntarily taking on extra people extra
voluntarily taking on extra people extra children to care for and then the third
children to care for and then the third
children to care for and then the third one is interesting because it’s not
one is interesting because it’s not
one is interesting because it’s not really about survival so much but it’s
really about survival so much but it’s
really about survival so much but it’s about the idea of building a school and
about the idea of building a school and
about the idea of building a school and promoting culture and it’s important to
promoting culture and it’s important to
promoting culture and it’s important to remember that too that microfinance is
remember that too that microfinance is
remember that too that microfinance is not just about helping people survive
not just about helping people survive
not just about helping people survive but it’s also about helping them build
but it’s also about helping them build
but it’s also about helping them build and get better at various things so it
and get better at various things so it
and get better at various things so it seems to me that when you read a
seems to me that when you read a
seems to me that when you read a sentence like that it sort of almost
sentence like that it sort of almost
sentence like that it sort of almost takes you into that person’s life and
takes you into that person’s life and
takes you into that person’s life and that’s really the fundamental thing of
that’s really the fundamental thing of
that’s really the fundamental thing of empathy but it doesn’t have to be a lot
empathy but it doesn’t have to be a lot
empathy but it doesn’t have to be a lot to do that it can be a very simple
to do that it can be a very simple
to do that it can be a very simple sentence or story it’s important to keep
sentence or story it’s important to keep
sentence or story it’s important to keep in mind with Kiva and with other forms
in mind with Kiva and with other forms
in mind with Kiva and with other forms of microfinance that we’re talking about
of microfinance that we’re talking about
of microfinance that we’re talking about very small amounts of money most of the
very small amounts of money most of the
very small amounts of money most of the loans that I dealt with were maybe three
loans that I dealt with were maybe three
loans that I dealt with were maybe three hundred five hundred dollars something
hundred five hundred dollars something
hundred five hundred dollars something like that but there’s something more
like that but there’s something more
like that but there’s something more important in the sense that these are
important in the sense that these are
important in the sense that these are people who’ve never had an opportunity
people who’ve never had an opportunity
people who’ve never had an opportunity before and so regardlessly the amount it
before and so regardlessly the amount it
before and so regardlessly the amount it gives them the sense that they’re in
gives them the sense that they’re in
gives them the sense that they’re in control that they have some power over
control that they have some power over
control that they have some power over their own destiny and from the other
their own destiny and from the other
their own destiny and from the other perspective as the bar as a lender you
perspective as the bar as a lender you
perspective as the bar as a lender you know whether you’re thinking about it or
know whether you’re thinking about it or
know whether you’re thinking about it or not you are saying to this person that
not you are saying to this person that
not you are saying to this person that I’m interested in your story I like your
I’m interested in your story I like your
I’m interested in your story I like your story and I want to help you come up
story and I want to help you come up
story and I want to help you come up with a better ending to your story and
with a better ending to your story and
with a better ending to your story and it’s also important to note that
it’s also important to note that
it’s also important to note that microfinance has a real possibility of
microfinance has a real possibility of
microfinance has a real possibility of failure traditional charity typically
failure traditional charity typically
failure traditional charity typically you know you expect that it’s going to
you know you expect that it’s going to
you know you expect that it’s going to succeed and if it doesn’t you might be
succeed and if it doesn’t you might be
succeed and if it doesn’t you might be upset understandably but with
upset understandably but with
upset understandably but with microfinance you’re taking that risk and
microfinance you’re taking that risk and
microfinance you’re taking that risk and I think that’s important because that
I think that’s important because that
I think that’s important because that means that on both ends from the
means that on both ends from the
means that on both ends from the borrower and the lender you know you
borrower and the lender you know you
borrower and the lender you know you have a real incentive for this to work
have a real incentive for this to work
have a real incentive for this to work and so a Kiva
and so a Kiva
and so a Kiva then in the end is really I think much
then in the end is really I think much
then in the end is really I think much more than the money but it’s about this
more than the money but it’s about this
more than the money but it’s about this idea that you have made an attempt to
idea that you have made an attempt to
idea that you have made an attempt to understand someone from a different
understand someone from a different
understand someone from a different country different language different
country different language different
country different language different culture and so on and you’re willing to
culture and so on and you’re willing to
culture and so on and you’re willing to you know put some skin in the game in
you know put some skin in the game in
you know put some skin in the game in terms of a little bit of money to try to
terms of a little bit of money to try to
terms of a little bit of money to try to make sure that they can do what they
make sure that they can do what they
make sure that they can do what they want and so that’s the power of
want and so that’s the power of
want and so that’s the power of narrative or empathy and that’s Kiva
narrative or empathy and that’s Kiva
narrative or empathy and that’s Kiva magic thank you
magic thank you
magic thank you [Applause]
”
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